August 2, 2006
@ 11:09 PM

I went to dotnetusers.org's meeting tonight for a WCF presentation. The presentation wasn’t as deep as I had been hoping. I am trying to get back into this stuff and need some oomph. After seeing more and more really awesome presenters, I am really starting to hate power point.

There were a few more people than at ssound.net in Olympia, but if we keep things going at ssdotnet, we can take 'em.

Ted Neward was there and some other people I almost recognized from somewhere.

Jason Haley indicated he was going, but I don’t know what he looks like (ok, look, there is a picture here…but I don’t think I saw you.)

For a large chunk of my developer career (from about 1999~2004) I was really, really interested in distributed systems. I remember when the ATL developer’s mailing list morphed into the SOAP mailing list (or maybe I morphed into someone reading the SOAP mailing list.) I loved COM+. I loved web services. When I first heard about Indigo, I was soo excited.

Then something kind of weird happened. I started seeing people actually building apps with XML Web Services. They sucked.

The last straw is still unfolding into my life. At work we are doing this huge, uber-high-stakes integration project with a third party application. The API blows chunks. I don't (really do) want to get into details, but someday, after I have filled my lungs with this, I will have some stories to tell, I am sure.

This is a high-visibility project and my boss is heavily leveraged. He (we) need this to work out well - but I just know something is wrong. All the signs are there. The first sign was when I saw they had a XML Web Service (...kind of thing....ahem) that returned a "cursor" (and I knew the backend database was Oracle...hmmm...cursors...Oracle...web services...)

Other signs:

  • They've been talking/planning/meeting 20+ hours a week about it for almost a year, but ask any two people and you'll get 3 different answers about what they are doing and how it all works. The tracking error grows geometrically as you move away from the source.
  • Every developer looks at the service interface and sees something different (I call them bad XML web services, but someone else might call it floor wax.)
  • I sense a lot of apathy from some of the people that are supposed to benefit from this.

reduced:

  • Lack of vision
  • Lack of cohesion
  • Lack of perceptible benefit


So what does this have to do with WCF? The reason I am having trouble getting back into this is that it is too far gone from reality. 3 years ago, it kind of sounded plausible that we would have all these people building loosely coupled apps with WS-* and the hundreds of specifications and rules they would have to learn to make it work right. Now...it frankly sounds kind of naive.

WCF makes it really easy to do things really right for Windows developers. For java developers there are things like this too, but when you read white papers from IBM or Oracle, you just know they aren't talking about exactly the same things. There is some kind of disconnect that keeps everybody from agreeing on things and just building stuff - and in the confusion, vendors like ours are born.

Being able to move up the food chain by claiming to support, "integrated, enterprise, solution-oriented, xml, distributed, _standards_based_, web services," is a boon to the sales forces of companies like this. Before they had libraries based on COM, Java, maybe perl or something, the sales guys didn’t know what any if that meant, and everything sort of worked. Nowadays you can put lipstick on a pile of XML pasta and sell it as a feature. All the sales guys “know” what that means, but not the developers.

I know we will be using WCF to unify how we build distributed apps in-house and I know some vendors will do the same thing. But we still have a long ways to go in integrating applications.

 


 
Thursday, August 03, 2006 6:40:04 AM (Pacific Standard Time, UTC-08:00)
I was the guy talking to Ruth outside the meeting the whole time ... sorry about that :(
Thursday, August 03, 2006 11:54:28 AM (Pacific Standard Time, UTC-08:00)
:-) No worries. I'm sure we'll see each other around sometime.
Thursday, August 03, 2006 5:22:47 PM (Pacific Standard Time, UTC-08:00)
I'll be at the Seattle Code Camp for sure. Planning on presenting something about Obfuscation or disassembling .net. Are you planning on presenting anything?
Thursday, August 03, 2006 6:07:00 PM (Pacific Standard Time, UTC-08:00)
Sweet! I am very interested in obfuscation, as I am sure lots of others are as well.

I don't think I'll be presenting anything unless I get really inspired. I was entertaining one idea, inspired by the Poker Bots presentation at PDX Code Camp: Stock Market Bots. Last year I started making ghetto trading systems using free data from yahoo, and the free trading simulator at investopedia. This didn't prove to be terribly useful, but was fun. I am not sure if anyone else would be interested, but I am still thinking about it.
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